What do PvE groups need from W/M's? - Page 2 - Guild Wars Forums

Ashleigh McMahon · Sep 14, 2005, 08:48 PM // 20:48

In my days as a W/Mo, I concidered my self a low damage dealing tank.

I took good damage, and delt a good bit with nice combos.

I'm now trying W/R.

If anyone has any good W/r pet using builds please pm me about it

Regards, Ashleigh.

Mavrik · Sep 14, 2005, 09:06 PM // 21:06

I made a warrior/monk for PvE purposes and mainly use the Monk skills like Mending, Remove conditions and Heal for myself. The rest of my status is to damage/kill as much as possible. When I use my other characters, I like for warriors to tank/hold enemies in place for my spells. As a warrior however I want to be able to last in the midst of battle, heal myself if needed and above all... kill kill kill.

The purpose of PvE W/Mo is to be a self sustaining, damage dealing shield for your group. Now a lot of PvE warrior/monks are for running and farming purposes as well. My lv 12 warrior/monk can solo those lv7 and 8 gargoyles with little difficulty. I have also been able to run myself all the way to beacon in a group. Its a good BUILD how be it overused build but I don't care. I didn't make the build for someone else's profit or enjoyment. I made it for myself to use how I want and its a great PvE combination with hench.

DangerMouse · Sep 14, 2005, 09:28 PM // 21:28

The biggest problem i have had is warrior characters being leeroy jenkins wannabes, and just blatantly no listening to the group for example in the group i use for fissure we have 5 regulars but need 1 monk 1 ele and 1 warrior to make up the numbers.
It seems 9 times out of ten we get a warrior that says they have cleared FoW heaps exp etc but then once in game they run from group to group dragging the team behind them not waiting for recharge or heading in the right direction and they generally die and then quit.

All i would like from warriors is to think of the groups build is it primarily casters? if so you should be playing the role of meat shield, letting casters do the dmg while you maybe smite a bit and mostly use defense, if the group has a large % of other warriors you can maybe go for a more dmg orientated build. But the biggest thing is to listen to the group if someone is saying they have low energy or need to recharge then wait dont run to the next group, if one of the casters is drawing alot of attention then go and attack the person hitting them try and take the aggro on to yourself and not the caster, and lastly follow the groups lead dont just head where you want to go cause the group may have a plan or know something you dont.

I have actually just finished building up a warrior as i got sick of the warriors who thought they were king and ruined all the runs, i wanted to be a smart warrior using more defense and meat shield skills, but hopefully i wont need to use him that often if more people take these aspects in to there game.

Jamski · Sep 14, 2005, 09:53 PM // 21:53

Mending.

Mending costs you 1 pip of regen. That's 1 energy every 3 seconds. It gives you 3 pips of health (at 8 healing). That's 6 health every second, or 18 health every 3 seconds. That's 18 health per energy, if you like.

Compare with Live Vicariously. That's also 1 energy every 3 seconds. At 8 Healing that's 8 health every time you swing. With a sword/axe that's 3 swings in 2 seconds, or 36 health every 3 seconds, or 36 health per energy. Hey that's twice as good as Mending!

Compare with Vigourous Spirit. This costs you a flat 5 energy and lasts 30 seconds. That's 8 health every time you swing. Over 30 seconds that's 360 health, or 72 health per energy. Hey that's four times as good as Mending!

Conclusion - Mending is RED ENGINE GO GO GOing awful.

Jhyphi · Sep 14, 2005, 10:30 PM // 22:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jamski

Mending.

Mending costs you 1 pip of regen. That's 1 energy every 3 seconds. It gives you 3 pips of health (at 8 healing). That's 6 health every second, or 18 health every 3 seconds. That's 18 health per energy, if you like.

Compare with Live Vicariously. That's also 1 energy every 3 seconds. At 8 Healing that's 8 health every time you swing. With a sword/axe that's 3 swings in 2 seconds, or 36 health every 3 seconds, or 36 health per energy. Hey that's twice as good as Mending!

Compare with Vigourous Spirit. This costs you a flat 5 energy and lasts 30 seconds. That's 8 health every time you swing. Over 30 seconds that's 360 health, or 72 health per energy. Hey that's four times as good as Mending!

Conclusion - Mending is RED ENGINE GO GO GOing awful.

Your math is off. Plus you're thinking only if targets stay there for you to hit like beanbags.

It's 3 swings every 4 seconds, IF they're not dodging, kiting, etc.

So best case scenario, Live Vicariously, with your 8 health a swing, is 24 health per 4 seconds, or 6 health a second, 18 health/energy, SAME AS MENDING ONLY IF YOU"RE HITTING CONTINUOUSLY. Also, live vicariously BOOSTS YOUR HEALTH, it can't help save squishies on your team.

Vigourous spirit can target squishies, but their attack speed is every 2 seconds so 8 health every 2 seconds is 4 health a second which is worse. If they're spamming osirin or something like that, it can get higher. Energy-wise, even at the 2 second speed, it's 15 attacks in 30 seconds for 120 health for 5 energy or 24 health/energy which is slightly greater. BUT LESS HEALTH/SECOND.

So, the MAIN PROBLEM with live vicariously and vigorous spirit is that both don't work if your squishy is kiting, running, etc. Live vicariously doesn't help your squishies at all. Vigorous spirit is less health/second and doesn't work if they're running at slightly increased energy efficiency.

CONCLUSION - Jamski, it's exactly your type of playing which gives w/mo a bad name. Mending/healing hands/etc. should be used to help teammates going down and from that standpoint is great.

GuildWarsPlayer · Sep 14, 2005, 10:50 PM // 22:50

Nope, that's far from being exact

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jamski

With a sword/axe that's 3 swings in 2 seconds

It's 2 swings in 4 secs (1 attack per 1,33 seconds for a sword/axe). This makes your calculations go the other way round.

over 30 seconds (at 8 healing), mending will grant you 180 health, live vicarously 56 and spirit 56... Mending is far more better than the other two.

Moreover, you forgot the fact that you need to hit to gain the health... Monsters tend to use wards, blinds, block/evade attacks, meaning you are gaining far less health with spirit or vicarously over mending.

These are all enchants so people can strip all 3 yes... just don't cast it back until the fight is over.

One skill you might be interested with is the healing signet (hooo don't flame yet, let me explain).
I'm mostly playing the tactics line because i do crap damage but want to tank good, and i think healing signet really fits on the build. Yes you will lose 40 AL during 2 seconds which is a real drawback if you're in melee... But then i find it has very nice advantages.
With 10 in tactics, you can net a nice 115 health for 0 energy, it's a signet so less likely to be interrupted than a spell (but can be), and recharges pretty fast.
Getting back to the -40 AL drawback, it's really nothing in melee because you can combine blocking skills with it... Use bonetti (at 10 tactics you have 75% blocking chance during 9 seconds) then the signet and you regain health in the middle of the battle at some critical points. This also work with other defensive stances such as gladiators etc...

Actually here is the skills i use for tanking, you may disagree but it can open up the discussion :
- Mending (Yeah people think it's noob i know)
- Healing breeze (Yeah another noob skill)
- Healing signet (Omg i'm still sticking to the noob skills !)
- Bonetti's defence
- 3 weapons skill (sword or axe depending on my mood, but i'd rather take the axe), one costing energy and 2 using adrenaline.
- The last slot is reserved for the elite, usually Shield of judgment, sometimes gladiator defence.

Okay i'm a warrior and i self heal, with noobs skills... But for having it played a long time (250 + hours on the W/Mo), it really take some load out of the healers because they can concentrate on the other team members.

Mending is your friend, continous healing is always nice, if you are bleeding you health will not fall down also (3 - 3 = 0 degen). Mending + Breeze will give you a temporary boost of 10 pips of regen, therefore you can be set on fire, health degenerated or poisoned and still gain health regen wich is really nice in hardcore situations. (if you are set on fire, poisoned, degenerated and bleeding at the same time, that's bad luck

).

I've had nice results using this, making tanking/blocking really effective if you practise the build a bit. True you don't have much damage output whith 3 weapons skills, but it's not the point of this build anyway. As stated before, other classes can really do a better job at it, especially when they don't have to run around because you died too early.

For the armor, the best choice for me is the ascalon helm (+1 tactic), galdiator chest, arms and legs (for the extra energy) and ascalon boots (for the damage reduction...). Stick a major vigor, major absoption, 1 minor tactic and 1 minor weapon (sword or axe) and you can get nice boosts for cheap.
And use a shield (preferably -2 absorb when enchanted).

I'm open to discussion don't hesitate to comment this build, but please remember that even if it looks like noobish, actually it does tank better and longer than most warriors builds.

Albino Chocobo · Sep 14, 2005, 11:03 PM // 23:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jamski

Mending.

Mending costs you 1 pip of regen. That's 1 energy every 3 seconds. It gives you 3 pips of health (at 8 healing). That's 6 health every second, or 18 health every 3 seconds. That's 18 health per energy, if you like.

Compare with Live Vicariously. That's also 1 energy every 3 seconds. At 8 Healing that's 8 health every time you swing. With a sword/axe that's 3 swings in 2 seconds, or 36 health every 3 seconds, or 36 health per energy. Hey that's twice as good as Mending!

Compare with Vigourous Spirit. This costs you a flat 5 energy and lasts 30 seconds. That's 8 health every time you swing. Over 30 seconds that's 360 health, or 72 health per energy. Hey that's four times as good as Mending!

Conclusion - Mending is RED ENGINE GO GO GOing awful.

OK, let me put the old glasses on :
* Live vicariously : While you maintain this "Enchantment", whenever target ally hits a foe, you gain 1-11 health.

Hits a foe, now. I have Blindness on me ! Evaded. Evaded. /me is dead, because foe won't get hit.

* Vigorous Spirit : what is this Disrupting Shot skill all those critter use on me ? Where is my Vigorous Spirit ? Why am I dead ?

Oh, I survived the fight. What ? My monk is in bad shape, and the party is poisoned by those nasty spiders ! What am I gonna do ? Quick, I cast LV on the elementalist ! That way, I gain a little health if he attacks a tree before croaking. No ! Shoot ! Let me try that : I cast Vigorous Spirit on the Ranger, so he gains a whooping 8 health after the 3s Troll Unguent cast.

Well, actually I guess Vigorous Spirit on a Monk in full healing mode could help there. Thing is, Mending is a sure-fire way to keep health up (barring spell disruption, which is bad in any case), and is cast before melee, which is always good. I've tried all 3 as a W/Mo, both soloing and in PvE parties, and I know I do better with Mending.

VGJustice · Sep 14, 2005, 11:32 PM // 23:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by audioaxes

i dont agree that the warriors have to be complete tanks in pve.

I agree. I've found that with my W/Me, I can ocasionally lay down a Chaos Storm as I pull the monsters into me. Then, I don't have to survive as long, as everything in front of me is getting their health dribbled away.

But, yeah, having a tank that can take a huge ammount of damage standing next to you can be a godsend for the more frail melee characters. If I can get the W/Mo to rush into a monster and distract it, I can sneak up behind it and gang up on it. This leaves me free to bombard it with everything I've got, and the healers in the group only have to worry about one of us.

GuildWarsPlayer · Sep 14, 2005, 11:44 PM // 23:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by wsmcasey

Besides from listening to the team and having a strategy, I really appreciate it when 1 warrior can take charge of the team and effectively call each and every target. This is the main reason I prefer the henches over normal pugs, because you can call targets and focus fire to quickly win fights. The warrior is a great and easy character to play, but most people that play warriors just don't have an effective strategy other than "me run, me hit stuff...uggg".

Really good avice also, people might say rangers/casters can be good target callers but Warriors can be very good at it also.

When you're tanking in the melee, mobs aggroed like mad around you, you can often find 1 or 2 seconds to press the View Targets button and check who will be the next ennemy. Locate it, then when your oppenent is down, quickly call the target you choose. If you are aggroing well and people are behind your blocking line, you'll be the first to reach the ennemy... So on again for another tanking session.

Right, sometimes you won't have the time to pick the best next target because the fight is getting hot and you didn't have time to view available targets. If this situation happens and the party has just just killed a mob, use the 'Choose nearest target' key then call it, take a look at what you picked and don't hesitate to switch to another target. It's always better to have a target called at any time during a fight than no target called at all and everybody striking his own mob...

For target selection i'd recommend this as a general advice (from highest to lowest priority):
- ennemy monks (ennemies also have to right to be healed

, one good healer on their side can make the mobs last really longer and even be resurrected sometimes)
- ennemy necros/mesmers (Usually those who will counter your strategies, break your spells, etc...)
- ennemy elementalists/rangers (Big damage source)
- ennemy warriors
- ennemy bosses (Because they are usually tougher to kill, but with 8 people pounding on them they can be slaughtered if no other foe is alive)

some exception to these priorities thought :
- A monk boss is a monk after all ! it should be targetted when no other monks are left in the ennemy lines.
- If one ennemy warrior passed your blocking line, he can really take down quickly a caster, so help your mate out !

Have a try at it

Albino Chocobo · Sep 15, 2005, 07:40 AM // 07:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuildWarsPlayer

It's 2 swings in 4 secs (1 attack per 1,33 seconds for a sword/axe). This makes your calculations go the other way round.

over 30 seconds (at 8 healing), mending will grant you 180 health, live vicarously 56 and spirit 56... Mending is far more better than the other two.

Jhyphi got it right in his corrective post.
1 attack per 1,33 seconds for a sword/axe means 3 attacks every 4 seconds (and not 2). At 8 HP per attack, that amount to 24 per 4 seconds, 180 per 30 seconds, same as Mending. Supposing they let you hit like crazy. It gets worse if you use it on a non-warrior : Elementalists won't attack/cast that fast anyhow. Plus Mending does 360 HP over 60 seconds, whereas VS needs recast, which can be interrupted.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuildWarsPlayer

For the armor, the best choice for me is the ascalon helm (+1 tactic), galdiator chest, arms and legs (for the extra energy) and ascalon boots (for the damage reduction...). Stick a major vigor, major absoption, 1 minor tactic and 1 minor weapon (sword or axe) and you can get nice boosts for cheap.
And use a shield (preferably -2 absorb when enchanted).

I think I read somewhere that A.net fixed the Ascalon/Knight's boots blanket protection bug in the last update...

GuildWarsPlayer · Sep 15, 2005, 08:18 AM // 08:18

Oups yeah, sad thing is that i can't count up to 3 ^^

About the knight/ascalon, as far as 2 days ago it was still working (i did a test and unless mergoyles always target the feet it reduces damage overall your body).

Evisicator · Sep 15, 2005, 08:35 AM // 08:35

Best 2 things I can tell you about being a good warrior.

1) Forget all that pulling bull only about one third of the mobs in the game need to be pulled. The rest you should go into and keep aggro from wanting to run past you and into your more fleshy targets.

and

2) I played as a monk 1st and this made me play a warrior far better. Why because, I truly know the hassles a monk goes thru when having to deal with idiots that we call tanks.

Charcoal Ann · Sep 15, 2005, 09:08 AM // 09:08

mending is good. just remember to take it off when you see a mesmer mob. heal sig can be good just remember to activate a stance before you use it. breeze i used to use a lot but i find it too costly in energy, once i buy my new set of glads though i will use it.
i keep thinking in terms of UW and Fissure of Woe. in fissure do not attack when you have spiteful spirit on. in UW bring I will survive!
i always bring Watch Yourself! incase a caster is being beaten upon that 20 extra armor can really help.

anywhere else then the only real suggestion is know thy enemy. if you know it is a low lvl swarm type area then bring Gladiators Defence.
if it is a high lvl big hitter area bring disciplined stance and ripost attacks.
if there are lots of conditions flying around then bring I Will Survive!
if there are lots of hexes flying around then it means that there is likely to be a ench stripper around so watch your mending and breeze carefully.

eightyfour-onesevenfive · Sep 15, 2005, 10:01 AM // 10:01

On another note about Mending, it is also a great way to influence mob's aggression. As most of you will know, any mobs like to attack monks first if they have the choice. This is especially true with henchmen. You will probably have observed mobs running straight past Stefan and Thom and go right for Alesia. Now having a constant Health regeneration changes that. If Alesia has Mending on her, mobs will very likely just ignore her and go for Orion instead. Who of course is a squishy, too, but less cruical to party survival. For that reason I often bring Mending with my W/Mo. Keeps the Monk from drawing too much attention.

RonGyver · Sep 15, 2005, 10:44 PM // 22:44

I love being a Tank, and Ive always played as one in every game for the most part.
I use stances and healing for the most and play the role of keeping myself alive and keeping the mobs attention focused on me while the other members kill stuff

Everyone has there own setup i guess but this is what i use for the most part. I like to use over lapping skills and stances so when one wears the other is ready.

My basic setup with my W/Mo is,

"Weapon" Axe - sometimes i use my Vamp axe 4/1
"Off Hand" Shield - Ugly as hell but -2 damage +4 Armor +45 Health w/stance
"Monk Skills"
Healing Breeze - umm Healing hehe
Vigorous Spirit - Love the healing used with Flurry & Cyclone Axe !!
Rebirth - Just in case thing get ugly

"Warrior Skills"
Cyclone Axe - Gets several mobs attention at once and keeps them on me
Dismember - 20% max health drop is nice
Axe Twist - used after Dismember adds damage and Weakends them
Executioner's Strike - I swap this with Axe Twist some times
Bonetti's Defense & or Watch Yourself - I switch depending

Again I use diff combos and these will change as i get more Elite skills, the ones i have so far i dont care for.

PS Just have fun while doing your job thats the key

PEACE!

AncientPC · Oct 02, 2005, 08:13 AM // 08:13

To sum up, W/Mo's are self-sustaining tanks first, damage do'ers second in PvE's.

It's your job to be taking the damage, and I've found the best way to do that is to aggro the mobs. As long as you can aggro them and sustain them yourself (don't depend on Monks to keep you alive), you're doing your job. However, make sure not too rush too fast and leave your party behind or without energy.

I stick 8 points in healing prayers and have 4 healing skills for PvE: Mending, Vigorous Spirit, Healing Breeze, and Life Touch. In addition I have Bonetti's Defense which helps with spell spamming. That only leaves 3 slots to attack skills, which is usually simply Flurry, Skewer (the Bleeding skill, can't think of the name at the moment) and Gash but it's enough.

I only started playing a week ago but have leveled up my warrior to 19, and I've noticed that there aren't many W/Mo's or even Warriors in the later missions these days. I'm pretty used to being the only tank for missions / quests, but with the above spells I tank pretty well.

Numa Pompilius · Oct 02, 2005, 09:03 AM // 09:03

One thing to add (beyond that yes, durability is more important than damage output; yes, mending is great in PvE, don't forget the cost of re-casting spells!; and yes, every warrior needs a longbow for pulling) is that the W/Mo should lead.

He should be one full aggro-circle ahead of the others while moving (but not much more) to make sure monsters concentrate on him, and unless you explain to your teammates what you're doing, they'll likely think you're "charging ahead blindly" and try to keep up. You don't want casters within one aggro circle of you until the monsters have all targeted you - if they get closer, the monsters will try to run past you to get to them.

Also, be sure to read the "the importance of positioning" sticky thread.

JodieFoster · Oct 02, 2005, 09:36 AM // 09:36

Alright, since nobody simply gave him a good respone here it is:

1. Tank
2. Damage

Enjoy

Or you can waste time with the other stuff...

I really recommend you simply take, and receive damage.

And also have a decent healer(which should be given).

-Jodie

Kamatsu · Oct 02, 2005, 10:19 AM // 10:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by GuildWarsPlayer

For the armor, the best choice for me is the ascalon helm (+1 tactic), galdiator chest, arms and legs (for the extra energy) and ascalon boots (for the damage reduction...). Stick a major vigor, major absoption, 1 minor tactic and 1 minor weapon (sword or axe) and you can get nice boosts for cheap.
And use a shield (preferably -2 absorb when enchanted).

I have to say that if your wanting +1 tactics on your whelm you might want to consider Gladiator's Helm. It's also a +1 Tactics helm, but it also provides +1 energy along with same AL & +physical as the Ascalon Helm. Only reason I can see to pick Ascalon Helm over Gladiator's is you don't care for +1 energy and/or you prefer the look of Ascalon over Gladiator's..

free_fall · Oct 02, 2005, 04:05 PM // 16:05

I've read this thread with great interest as it's given me a lot to think about in terms of what my W/Mo should be doing while in a group.

I play almost exclusively with henchies and my normal technique with them is to use the Desert Collector's Smiting rod as my primary weapon; when I select a target and start firing, Stefan and Tom run in to pound it and the casters stay grouped back around me. By casting Zealot's Fire before starting, I can target either of them with Dwayna's Kiss (because it's fast and cheap and recharges quicky) to burn the mobs they're meleeing with. If things get thick, I then wade in with my axe to help them out. This is while using Watch Yourself almost continuously.

This has worked pretty well with the henchies but I can see now that on those occassions I've grouped with other players it may have left them wondering WTF is this guy doing. Recently I've been more willing to go in earlier with the axe, not because anyone has said anything but because I started wondering if maybe people weren't expecting something a little different from a "warrior". I may trying altering my strategy to include tanking a bit more, now that I have a better understanding of it.

I've done a bit of this with my henchies in certain situations (when people were pooh-poohing Endure Pain in another forum, I said I'd much rather rush a group of Hydras or Giants with 770 health than 540), but have found this usually brings the squishies (what a delightful term, this is the 1st time I've come across it) too close to the mobs. Hanging back using the rod avoids much of that and helps keep Alesia from tanking and concentrated on healing Stefan and Tom.

Sep 14, 2005, 08:48 PM // 20:48	#21
Ashleigh McMahon Site Contributor Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: North East England Guild: WoTU[Warlords of the Underworld] Profession: Mo/Me	In my days as a W/Mo, I concidered my self a low damage dealing tank. I took good damage, and delt a good bit with nice combos. I'm now trying W/R. If anyone has any good W/r pet using builds please pm me about it Regards, Ashleigh.

Sep 14, 2005, 09:06 PM // 21:06	#22
Mavrik Forge Runner Join Date: May 2005 Location: Alaska	I made a warrior/monk for PvE purposes and mainly use the Monk skills like Mending, Remove conditions and Heal for myself. The rest of my status is to damage/kill as much as possible. When I use my other characters, I like for warriors to tank/hold enemies in place for my spells. As a warrior however I want to be able to last in the midst of battle, heal myself if needed and above all... kill kill kill. The purpose of PvE W/Mo is to be a self sustaining, damage dealing shield for your group. Now a lot of PvE warrior/monks are for running and farming purposes as well. My lv 12 warrior/monk can solo those lv7 and 8 gargoyles with little difficulty. I have also been able to run myself all the way to beacon in a group. Its a good BUILD how be it overused build but I don't care. I didn't make the build for someone else's profit or enjoyment. I made it for myself to use how I want and its a great PvE combination with hench.

Sep 14, 2005, 09:28 PM // 21:28	#23
DangerMouse Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: New Zealand Guild: Teh Fellowship Profession: N/Mo	The biggest problem i have had is warrior characters being leeroy jenkins wannabes, and just blatantly no listening to the group for example in the group i use for fissure we have 5 regulars but need 1 monk 1 ele and 1 warrior to make up the numbers. It seems 9 times out of ten we get a warrior that says they have cleared FoW heaps exp etc but then once in game they run from group to group dragging the team behind them not waiting for recharge or heading in the right direction and they generally die and then quit. All i would like from warriors is to think of the groups build is it primarily casters? if so you should be playing the role of meat shield, letting casters do the dmg while you maybe smite a bit and mostly use defense, if the group has a large % of other warriors you can maybe go for a more dmg orientated build. But the biggest thing is to listen to the group if someone is saying they have low energy or need to recharge then wait dont run to the next group, if one of the casters is drawing alot of attention then go and attack the person hitting them try and take the aggro on to yourself and not the caster, and lastly follow the groups lead dont just head where you want to go cause the group may have a plan or know something you dont. I have actually just finished building up a warrior as i got sick of the warriors who thought they were king and ruined all the runs, i wanted to be a smart warrior using more defense and meat shield skills, but hopefully i wont need to use him that often if more people take these aspects in to there game.

Sep 14, 2005, 09:53 PM // 21:53	#24
Jamski Academy Page Join Date: Sep 2005	Mending. Mending costs you 1 pip of regen. That's 1 energy every 3 seconds. It gives you 3 pips of health (at 8 healing). That's 6 health every second, or 18 health every 3 seconds. That's 18 health per energy, if you like. Compare with Live Vicariously. That's also 1 energy every 3 seconds. At 8 Healing that's 8 health every time you swing. With a sword/axe that's 3 swings in 2 seconds, or 36 health every 3 seconds, or 36 health per energy. Hey that's twice as good as Mending! Compare with Vigourous Spirit. This costs you a flat 5 energy and lasts 30 seconds. That's 8 health every time you swing. Over 30 seconds that's 360 health, or 72 health per energy. Hey that's four times as good as Mending! Conclusion - Mending is RED ENGINE GO GO GOing awful.

Sep 15, 2005, 08:18 AM // 08:18	#31
GuildWarsPlayer Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Sep 2005	Oups yeah, sad thing is that i can't count up to 3 ^^ About the knight/ascalon, as far as 2 days ago it was still working (i did a test and unless mergoyles always target the feet it reduces damage overall your body).

Sep 15, 2005, 08:35 AM // 08:35	#32
Evisicator Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Jun 2005	Best 2 things I can tell you about being a good warrior. 1) Forget all that pulling bull only about one third of the mobs in the game need to be pulled. The rest you should go into and keep aggro from wanting to run past you and into your more fleshy targets. and 2) I played as a monk 1st and this made me play a warrior far better. Why because, I truly know the hassles a monk goes thru when having to deal with idiots that we call tanks.

Sep 15, 2005, 09:08 AM // 09:08	#33
Charcoal Ann Wilds Pathfinder Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In a World of BADGERS! Guild: Eternal Flame Brotherhood	mending is good. just remember to take it off when you see a mesmer mob. heal sig can be good just remember to activate a stance before you use it. breeze i used to use a lot but i find it too costly in energy, once i buy my new set of glads though i will use it. i keep thinking in terms of UW and Fissure of Woe. in fissure do not attack when you have spiteful spirit on. in UW bring I will survive! i always bring Watch Yourself! incase a caster is being beaten upon that 20 extra armor can really help. anywhere else then the only real suggestion is know thy enemy. if you know it is a low lvl swarm type area then bring Gladiators Defence. if it is a high lvl big hitter area bring disciplined stance and ripost attacks. if there are lots of conditions flying around then bring I Will Survive! if there are lots of hexes flying around then it means that there is likely to be a ench stripper around so watch your mending and breeze carefully.

Sep 15, 2005, 10:01 AM // 10:01	#34
eightyfour-onesevenfive Wilds Pathfinder Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: 7??13'35" E - 50??06'27" N Guild: Servants of Fortuna [SoF]	On another note about Mending, it is also a great way to influence mob's aggression. As most of you will know, any mobs like to attack monks first if they have the choice. This is especially true with henchmen. You will probably have observed mobs running straight past Stefan and Thom and go right for Alesia. Now having a constant Health regeneration changes that. If Alesia has Mending on her, mobs will very likely just ignore her and go for Orion instead. Who of course is a squishy, too, but less cruical to party survival. For that reason I often bring Mending with my W/Mo. Keeps the Monk from drawing too much attention.

Sep 15, 2005, 10:44 PM // 22:44	#35
RonGyver Ascalonian Squire Join Date: May 2005	I love being a Tank, and Ive always played as one in every game for the most part. I use stances and healing for the most and play the role of keeping myself alive and keeping the mobs attention focused on me while the other members kill stuff Everyone has there own setup i guess but this is what i use for the most part. I like to use over lapping skills and stances so when one wears the other is ready. My basic setup with my W/Mo is, "Weapon" Axe - sometimes i use my Vamp axe 4/1 "Off Hand" Shield - Ugly as hell but -2 damage +4 Armor +45 Health w/stance "Monk Skills" Healing Breeze - umm Healing hehe Vigorous Spirit - Love the healing used with Flurry & Cyclone Axe !! Rebirth - Just in case thing get ugly "Warrior Skills" Cyclone Axe - Gets several mobs attention at once and keeps them on me Dismember - 20% max health drop is nice Axe Twist - used after Dismember adds damage and Weakends them Executioner's Strike - I swap this with Axe Twist some times Bonetti's Defense & or Watch Yourself - I switch depending Again I use diff combos and these will change as i get more Elite skills, the ones i have so far i dont care for. PS Just have fun while doing your job thats the key PEACE!

Oct 02, 2005, 08:13 AM // 08:13	#36
AncientPC Forge Runner Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Ascalon 1 Profession: W/R	To sum up, W/Mo's are self-sustaining tanks first, damage do'ers second in PvE's. It's your job to be taking the damage, and I've found the best way to do that is to aggro the mobs. As long as you can aggro them and sustain them yourself (don't depend on Monks to keep you alive), you're doing your job. However, make sure not too rush too fast and leave your party behind or without energy. I stick 8 points in healing prayers and have 4 healing skills for PvE: Mending, Vigorous Spirit, Healing Breeze, and Life Touch. In addition I have Bonetti's Defense which helps with spell spamming. That only leaves 3 slots to attack skills, which is usually simply Flurry, Skewer (the Bleeding skill, can't think of the name at the moment) and Gash but it's enough. I only started playing a week ago but have leveled up my warrior to 19, and I've noticed that there aren't many W/Mo's or even Warriors in the later missions these days. I'm pretty used to being the only tank for missions / quests, but with the above spells I tank pretty well.

Oct 02, 2005, 09:03 AM // 09:03	#37
Numa Pompilius Grotto Attendant Join Date: May 2005 Location: At an Insit.. Intis... a house. Guild: Live Forever Or Die Trying [GLHF] Profession: W/Me	One thing to add (beyond that yes, durability is more important than damage output; yes, mending is great in PvE, don't forget the cost of re-casting spells!; and yes, every warrior needs a longbow for pulling) is that the W/Mo should lead. He should be one full aggro-circle ahead of the others while moving (but not much more) to make sure monsters concentrate on him, and unless you explain to your teammates what you're doing, they'll likely think you're "charging ahead blindly" and try to keep up. You don't want casters within one aggro circle of you until the monsters have all targeted you - if they get closer, the monsters will try to run past you to get to them. Also, be sure to read the "the importance of positioning" sticky thread.

Oct 02, 2005, 09:36 AM // 09:36	#38
JodieFoster Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Michigan Guild: SOUL Profession: Me/N	Alright, since nobody simply gave him a good respone here it is: 1. Tank 2. Damage Enjoy Or you can waste time with the other stuff... I really recommend you simply take, and receive damage. And also have a decent healer(which should be given). -Jodie

Oct 02, 2005, 04:05 PM // 16:05	#40
free_fall Wilds Pathfinder Join Date: Oct 2005	I've read this thread with great interest as it's given me a lot to think about in terms of what my W/Mo should be doing while in a group. I play almost exclusively with henchies and my normal technique with them is to use the Desert Collector's Smiting rod as my primary weapon; when I select a target and start firing, Stefan and Tom run in to pound it and the casters stay grouped back around me. By casting Zealot's Fire before starting, I can target either of them with Dwayna's Kiss (because it's fast and cheap and recharges quicky) to burn the mobs they're meleeing with. If things get thick, I then wade in with my axe to help them out. This is while using Watch Yourself almost continuously. This has worked pretty well with the henchies but I can see now that on those occassions I've grouped with other players it may have left them wondering WTF is this guy doing. Recently I've been more willing to go in earlier with the axe, not because anyone has said anything but because I started wondering if maybe people weren't expecting something a little different from a "warrior". I may trying altering my strategy to include tanking a bit more, now that I have a better understanding of it. I've done a bit of this with my henchies in certain situations (when people were pooh-poohing Endure Pain in another forum, I said I'd much rather rush a group of Hydras or Giants with 770 health than 540), but have found this usually brings the squishies (what a delightful term, this is the 1st time I've come across it) too close to the mobs. Hanging back using the rod avoids much of that and helps keep Alesia from tanking and concentrated on healing Stefan and Tom.